How much lateral wobble is there on the keys? One of the things I dislike with the Corsair K90 that I currently use is that the key caps feel very wobbly and seem to make it easier for my fingers to "slip" off the keys when I'm trying to press them.
I don't have the Specturm, but I can tell you that the Spark is more stable than the K90 as far as lateral key wobble goes. I'd expect the Spectrum to be similar as they both use Romer-G switches that support the key closer to the edges rather than the middle. There is also no keyboard flex to speak of that might, in other keyboards, contribute to lateral instability. The Spark's key caps are not easy to slip off of either, but it seems many people don't like the ridges.
I actually didn't mind the Spark's key caps after I got used to them. I found myself more accurately hitting the middle of the key and less often catching the edge. The palm rest looks to be a big improvement, though, and I'm wondering if I could acquire a spectrum palm rest for my spark. They look to have the same mount. Of course, I paid less than $100 for my Spark, and certainly don't think it is worth an extra $80 to change the keycaps and palm rest. That said, I wouldn't recommend skimping on it if the key caps bother you either. I always find it funny how much some people will spend on the internals of a computer while neglecting the three devices that make up %90+ of your interaction with the computer (Monitor, Keyboard, Mouse).
Perhaps the keys are slightly different on the Spectrum than the Spark, but I very slightly disagree with the authors assessment (at least in regards to the Spark). While I agree that the tactile bump is certainly less pronounced than Cherry's MX Brown switches, I do not think they can be compared to Cherry MX Red switches. Perhaps I'm more sensitive to the bump, but I have no trouble feeling it. Where Reds give me a dissatisfying lack of feedback, Romer-G provide a subtle, but distinct response only a little less satisfying than the Browns for typing. A slightly longer throw might be better for typing as well, though I consider both the feedback and throw to be some of the best for gaming.
It's not technically wrong to use myriad in noun form, but please...reconsider doing so.
In the headline: "Logitech is perhaps the most reputable manufacturer of peripherals on the planet, with [myriad] products for PCs, mobile devices and consoles."
I realize I'm being overscrupulous, but many Grammarians argue that the noun form doesn't make sense.
Also, the use of "sit on their laurels" (page 1) is reversed from the right context. Logitech would be "resting on their laurels" if they had created the best keyboard out there, only for it to languish over time to the competition.
I started my comment with a pre-emption of your response; the noun form is not technically incorrect. However, any serious wordsmith avoids the syntax produced by the noun form. "the sedan can be ordered with a myriad of options" is obviously inferior to "the sedan can be ordered with myriad options."
This is a lot for a mechanical keyboard with RGB. Sharkoon's MK80 can be had for far less and is 100% programmable as well, only lacking the macro and multimedia keys - which is more of a matter of preference than production cost.
I'd argue that no one is being ripped off. What you're seeing is a price the company believes the market is willing to endure. A lot of people believe they're reaping a benefit worth the cost when they pay $50-200 USD for a keyboard. What they get back is only emotional satisfaction as there's no evidence that a "gamer" keyboard makes your character run forward better when the W key is mashed over a membrane keyboard, but because the buyer believes they've reaped some sort of a reward, the purchase is made anyway. If you want to blame anyone for stupid keyboard prices, blame the ones who are buying these things. They created the market for them in the first place.
I would also add that the gaming specific market has driven prices up with products bearing a team name or the name of the guy who won the last tournament. Putting fancy colors on the product, standout packaging, and an endorsement from a "pro" gamer and you drive the price up. Like you said there are people buying these when the same functionality can be had elsewhere. Companies like Razer really take advantage of this consumer segment.
It's really a combination of the two IMO. The companies marketing gear specific to gaming to "give you the winning edge", as well as the people buying it. All manner of parts and peripherals are like this. It's not just keyboards.
Back in the day, those keyboards were cheap because they were mass produced, and they had no special features. These days, they are not mass produced in the quantities that they were back then. As production numbers go down, the price to produce goes up.
But, I do think $180 is kind of steep. I paid $120 each for my Razer Black Widow Ultimates (both stealths), but I don't think I could justify $180.
...except they weren't. At its cheapest the IBM Model M's list price only approached $100 from the high side after launching for more than double that. And remember than inflation means that prices from 30 years ago are something like twice as expensive as the raw number suggests.
I think the cost got passed down to customers, but expensive PCs are just no longer a reality. Dell used to ship awesome keyboards until the early 2000's, they had ALPS switches (like the AT-101 series.) But it was all cost of the parcel, and once PCs were a commodity the price had to come down, so here are your $10 rubber domes.
I very well remember buying a 'Cherry Gold' keyboard for good money back in the 90's. It was about $80 then.
Back in the days, a spare keyboard felt cheap because you'd just paid 5,000 bucks for a mid range PC. I can remember paying around $150 for a keyboard back in the days. Add inflation to that and you'll realise these keyboards today really aren't that expensive. Yes, there are a lot of $10 budget keyboards today but, you get what you pay for when buying those.
I remember very well paying 50 German Marks for different HP and Cherry mechanical keyboards (that I still have here). That would be about 25 Euro. So dont talk crap about them being expensive. Generally a set of mouse and keyboard with good quality would have been around 100 German Marks. Now its 100 Euro. Of course back then there was overpriced stuff too, but you were able to get high quality mechanical keyboards for MUCH MUCH less than today. I paid 80 Euro for my keyboard, and its still worse than the old mechanical ones from the ergonomics standpoint. It only has lighting and useless macros, which the old ones didnt have.
I have many mechanical keyboards and these Romer G switches are by far the best mechanical switches I have used. They are quiet, fast and reliable. I am not so sure about the actual design of the Logitech keyboards themselves, the wrist support is lousy and the keyboards are asymmetrical (looking at you G410). If you can overlook the actual design then the key stroke and switches are close to perfect for me. I have a bunch of Corsair and Coolermaster keyboards sitting in my storeroom that I did not care for.
interesting that they send the us international layout considering its really only commonly used in the netherlands. Even here a lot of manufacturers don't produce specific us international keyboards
"The limited programmability however is disappointing considering the target group of the keyboard, with only the nine G keys being programmable on the entire keyboard"
Thats not entirely correct. The macro switch keys (M1, M2 & M3) allow switching between sets of 9. So actually it's 3*9=27
I currently own the first Orion Spark version and to be honest i see no reason to upgrade. For those concerned with keycap shape you can also buy cylindrical kaps for Spark: http://gaming.logitech.com/en-us/product/romer-g-k...
Plus (atleast where i live) the Spectrum version is actually more expensive than the Spark version. Problably because Spectrum is a "new" product.
The only major downside i've found on the Spark is the LED color issue where (at least to my eyes) the white and yellow colors are not quite what they should be. Yellow appears more greenish and white appears as a pale blue. Aside from that - no complaints here.
@R7: "The only major downside i've found on the Spark is the LED color issue where (at least to my eyes) the white and yellow colors are not quite what they should be. Yellow appears more greenish and white appears as a pale blue. Aside from that - no complaints here."
I've found that you can compensate the white issue by setting the color in Setpoint to a very light red. My whites were a very pale cyan, though. If you are pale blue, you may need a light yellow. Your yellow setting shouldn't have any blue in it, though, so it sounds like your red LEDs are relatively week. You could probably get a better yellow by setting it slightly orange.
Yep, that Enter key with a tiny backslash is an automatic deal killer for me.... i would not care one bit what kind of key or switch or whatever..... trash it is.
I have been using the Orion Spark for some time and I do like it. There's one thing missing here in the gaming software set that I don't think the reviewer had time to really experience but that I loved.
I don't know how many profiles the software will detect but it will pick up whatever game you're not playing and customize the lighting on the keyboard to match.
For instance, I'll just be using Windows and the keyboard will be totally backlit. But if I fire up The Division, the software will recognize it and customize the lighting to match the game turning off the keys not needed.
It even goes a further step by detecting if you even need the key you'd normally use during the game. For instance, the G key is for a grenade. It lights up like normal but if you use up all of your grenades the key will turn off. When you pick up more the key will turn itself back on.
Wow that's expensive for a non customizable, non serviceable, no frills mechanical keyboard. I mean the Das Keyboard, and especially those from Thermaltake and even Corsair, offer basically the same functionality with more features and serviceability for half the price.
I don't expect them to sell many of these outside of Beat Buy where it will appeal to people who want to "spend the most money to get the best product"
Great keyboard. I didn't have a problem with the Orion Spark keys, so I'm not sure why they'd change the key design for the spectrum. I don't have the spectrum and I bought the spark for $60 USD on black friday. Best keyboard purchase ever. The per game and dynamic key lighting is fantastic. Major downside IMO is the lack of a USB passthrough, since the cheaper offerings sometimes offer it. No lateral key wobble that I've experienced on the Spark
Could someone shed light on whether this keyboard's keys are as tightly packed as the G710 models? One of the biggest issues I have with the G710+ is that the keys are too densely fitted. I just measured the distance between the left and right Shift keys and it is 11 and 1/16 inches long. Would really appreciate a measurement. Thanks.
Any chance you could get one of the original model M keyboards in for review? U icomp still makes them. I'd be interested in how it stacks up with modern mechanical keyboards.
Is it just me or is this site going to the dogs? This is the second uninteresting keyboard review I've read here in recent weeks. I guess this is a gamer's review site now, huh? I'll pass.
180 $ is way too expensive for a plastic non-cherry mx keyboard.
Regarding macro buttons, I know of no gamers using them, and I'm really wondering if I simply do not know enough gamers, or if it's the ultimate non used feature. In many games, it is forbidden to use macros keys, and in even more games on professional encounters.
Has separate special function keys instead of using the normal function keys double: Huge plus Has a scroll lock key: good job Logitech. Has a non-removable hand-rest: Oh dear. But they make dremels so that's solvable I suppose. Another negative is that design on the WASD keys, it's not pretty.
So I'm pretty positive, and as for that double key, it normally registers under a different keycode so you can reprogram it I expect.
I also like that the extra keys are on the side, I think Apple should have done that with their touch bar, since Apple putting it right under the screen on a laptop seems less than ideal to me.
But in the end I will not pay 180 bucks for a keyboard, so I'm out.
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43 Comments
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klagermkii - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
How much lateral wobble is there on the keys? One of the things I dislike with the Corsair K90 that I currently use is that the key caps feel very wobbly and seem to make it easier for my fingers to "slip" off the keys when I'm trying to press them.BurntMyBacon - Friday, October 7, 2016 - link
I don't have the Specturm, but I can tell you that the Spark is more stable than the K90 as far as lateral key wobble goes. I'd expect the Spectrum to be similar as they both use Romer-G switches that support the key closer to the edges rather than the middle. There is also no keyboard flex to speak of that might, in other keyboards, contribute to lateral instability. The Spark's key caps are not easy to slip off of either, but it seems many people don't like the ridges.I actually didn't mind the Spark's key caps after I got used to them. I found myself more accurately hitting the middle of the key and less often catching the edge. The palm rest looks to be a big improvement, though, and I'm wondering if I could acquire a spectrum palm rest for my spark. They look to have the same mount. Of course, I paid less than $100 for my Spark, and certainly don't think it is worth an extra $80 to change the keycaps and palm rest. That said, I wouldn't recommend skimping on it if the key caps bother you either. I always find it funny how much some people will spend on the internals of a computer while neglecting the three devices that make up %90+ of your interaction with the computer (Monitor, Keyboard, Mouse).
Perhaps the keys are slightly different on the Spectrum than the Spark, but I very slightly disagree with the authors assessment (at least in regards to the Spark). While I agree that the tactile bump is certainly less pronounced than Cherry's MX Brown switches, I do not think they can be compared to Cherry MX Red switches. Perhaps I'm more sensitive to the bump, but I have no trouble feeling it. Where Reds give me a dissatisfying lack of feedback, Romer-G provide a subtle, but distinct response only a little less satisfying than the Browns for typing. A slightly longer throw might be better for typing as well, though I consider both the feedback and throw to be some of the best for gaming.
xerandin - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
It's not technically wrong to use myriad in noun form, but please...reconsider doing so.In the headline:
"Logitech is perhaps the most reputable manufacturer of peripherals on the planet, with [myriad] products for PCs, mobile devices and consoles."
I realize I'm being overscrupulous, but many Grammarians argue that the noun form doesn't make sense.
Ryan Smith - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
Thanks!mjrpes3 - Sunday, October 9, 2016 - link
Also, the use of "sit on their laurels" (page 1) is reversed from the right context. Logitech would be "resting on their laurels" if they had created the best keyboard out there, only for it to languish over time to the competition.plsbugmenot - Tuesday, May 29, 2018 - link
myriad is an adjective and a noun.Your reply contains a myriad of inconsistencies.
I groan at the myraid inconsistencies within your reply.
xerandin - Tuesday, September 8, 2020 - link
I started my comment with a pre-emption of your response; the noun form is not technically incorrect.However, any serious wordsmith avoids the syntax produced by the noun form. "the sedan can be ordered with a myriad of options" is obviously inferior to "the sedan can be ordered with myriad options."
It's hardly debatable...
cmdrdredd - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
Man $180. I thought $99 for my Leopold Mechanical keyboard about 5 years ago was a lot.Vayra - Friday, October 7, 2016 - link
This is a lot for a mechanical keyboard with RGB. Sharkoon's MK80 can be had for far less and is 100% programmable as well, only lacking the macro and multimedia keys - which is more of a matter of preference than production cost.damianrobertjones - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
To think that, back in the day, mechanical keyboards were on everything and super cheap. It's amazing how companies rip people off.BrokenCrayons - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
I'd argue that no one is being ripped off. What you're seeing is a price the company believes the market is willing to endure. A lot of people believe they're reaping a benefit worth the cost when they pay $50-200 USD for a keyboard. What they get back is only emotional satisfaction as there's no evidence that a "gamer" keyboard makes your character run forward better when the W key is mashed over a membrane keyboard, but because the buyer believes they've reaped some sort of a reward, the purchase is made anyway. If you want to blame anyone for stupid keyboard prices, blame the ones who are buying these things. They created the market for them in the first place.cmdrdredd - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
I would also add that the gaming specific market has driven prices up with products bearing a team name or the name of the guy who won the last tournament. Putting fancy colors on the product, standout packaging, and an endorsement from a "pro" gamer and you drive the price up. Like you said there are people buying these when the same functionality can be had elsewhere. Companies like Razer really take advantage of this consumer segment.It's really a combination of the two IMO. The companies marketing gear specific to gaming to "give you the winning edge", as well as the people buying it. All manner of parts and peripherals are like this. It's not just keyboards.
Murloc - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
but it's not like the das keyboard which aims at being essential is cheap either.shabby - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
Lets just hope these companies don't figure out that putting "tactical" will also increase sales and desirability.BurntMyBacon - Friday, October 7, 2016 - link
Shoot me now.Stuka87 - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
Back in the day, those keyboards were cheap because they were mass produced, and they had no special features. These days, they are not mass produced in the quantities that they were back then. As production numbers go down, the price to produce goes up.But, I do think $180 is kind of steep. I paid $120 each for my Razer Black Widow Ultimates (both stealths), but I don't think I could justify $180.
DanNeely - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
...except they weren't. At its cheapest the IBM Model M's list price only approached $100 from the high side after launching for more than double that. And remember than inflation means that prices from 30 years ago are something like twice as expensive as the raw number suggests.https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=9629.0
hansmuff - Saturday, October 8, 2016 - link
I think the cost got passed down to customers, but expensive PCs are just no longer a reality. Dell used to ship awesome keyboards until the early 2000's, they had ALPS switches (like the AT-101 series.) But it was all cost of the parcel, and once PCs were a commodity the price had to come down, so here are your $10 rubber domes.I very well remember buying a 'Cherry Gold' keyboard for good money back in the 90's. It was about $80 then.
theduckofdeath - Sunday, October 9, 2016 - link
Back in the days, a spare keyboard felt cheap because you'd just paid 5,000 bucks for a mid range PC. I can remember paying around $150 for a keyboard back in the days. Add inflation to that and you'll realise these keyboards today really aren't that expensive.Yes, there are a lot of $10 budget keyboards today but, you get what you pay for when buying those.
Beaver M. - Tuesday, October 18, 2016 - link
I remember very well paying 50 German Marks for different HP and Cherry mechanical keyboards (that I still have here). That would be about 25 Euro. So dont talk crap about them being expensive. Generally a set of mouse and keyboard with good quality would have been around 100 German Marks. Now its 100 Euro. Of course back then there was overpriced stuff too, but you were able to get high quality mechanical keyboards for MUCH MUCH less than today.I paid 80 Euro for my keyboard, and its still worse than the old mechanical ones from the ergonomics standpoint. It only has lighting and useless macros, which the old ones didnt have.
Footman36 - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
I have many mechanical keyboards and these Romer G switches are by far the best mechanical switches I have used. They are quiet, fast and reliable. I am not so sure about the actual design of the Logitech keyboards themselves, the wrist support is lousy and the keyboards are asymmetrical (looking at you G410). If you can overlook the actual design then the key stroke and switches are close to perfect for me. I have a bunch of Corsair and Coolermaster keyboards sitting in my storeroom that I did not care for.qlum - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
interesting that they send the us international layout considering its really only commonly used in the netherlands. Even here a lot of manufacturers don't produce specific us international keyboardsVayra - Friday, October 7, 2016 - link
I'm not a huge fan of the Romer G switches, but then I really like to have a bit more tactile feedback and more travel.R7 - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
"The limited programmability however is disappointing considering the target group of the keyboard, with only the nine G keys being programmable on the entire keyboard"Thats not entirely correct. The macro switch keys (M1, M2 & M3) allow switching between sets of 9. So actually it's 3*9=27
I currently own the first Orion Spark version and to be honest i see no reason to upgrade. For those concerned with keycap shape you can also buy cylindrical kaps for Spark: http://gaming.logitech.com/en-us/product/romer-g-k...
Plus (atleast where i live) the Spectrum version is actually more expensive than the Spark version. Problably because Spectrum is a "new" product.
The only major downside i've found on the Spark is the LED color issue where (at least to my eyes) the white and yellow colors are not quite what they should be. Yellow appears more greenish and white appears as a pale blue. Aside from that - no complaints here.
BurntMyBacon - Friday, October 7, 2016 - link
@R7: "The only major downside i've found on the Spark is the LED color issue where (at least to my eyes) the white and yellow colors are not quite what they should be. Yellow appears more greenish and white appears as a pale blue. Aside from that - no complaints here."I've found that you can compensate the white issue by setting the color in Setpoint to a very light red. My whites were a very pale cyan, though. If you are pale blue, you may need a light yellow. Your yellow setting shouldn't have any blue in it, though, so it sounds like your red LEDs are relatively week. You could probably get a better yellow by setting it slightly orange.
NeonFlak - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
Is it just me, or does the keyboard graphic on the box not show the actual product? Look at the enter keys.Ryan Smith - Friday, October 7, 2016 - link
Our best guess is that Logitech is making both ANSI and ISO layout boards, but only using ANSI for the box art.Houdani - Friday, October 7, 2016 - link
If I opened the box and found an ISO layout for the [enter] and [backslash], I would immediately box it up and send it away. Begone!SteelRing - Friday, October 7, 2016 - link
Yep, that Enter key with a tiny backslash is an automatic deal killer for me.... i would not care one bit what kind of key or switch or whatever..... trash it is.bearxor - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
I have been using the Orion Spark for some time and I do like it. There's one thing missing here in the gaming software set that I don't think the reviewer had time to really experience but that I loved.I don't know how many profiles the software will detect but it will pick up whatever game you're not playing and customize the lighting on the keyboard to match.
For instance, I'll just be using Windows and the keyboard will be totally backlit. But if I fire up The Division, the software will recognize it and customize the lighting to match the game turning off the keys not needed.
It even goes a further step by detecting if you even need the key you'd normally use during the game. For instance, the G key is for a grenade. It lights up like normal but if you use up all of your grenades the key will turn off. When you pick up more the key will turn itself back on.
Really cool.
Samus - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
Wow that's expensive for a non customizable, non serviceable, no frills mechanical keyboard. I mean the Das Keyboard, and especially those from Thermaltake and even Corsair, offer basically the same functionality with more features and serviceability for half the price.I don't expect them to sell many of these outside of Beat Buy where it will appeal to people who want to "spend the most money to get the best product"
Death666Angel - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
So they fixed the horrible key caps? Couldn't type on the G910 Orion, even after a week or use. Had to send it back.MyNuts - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
Its 2016 cant we make a keyboard right ?Sushisamurai - Thursday, October 6, 2016 - link
Great keyboard. I didn't have a problem with the Orion Spark keys, so I'm not sure why they'd change the key design for the spectrum. I don't have the spectrum and I bought the spark for $60 USD on black friday. Best keyboard purchase ever. The per game and dynamic key lighting is fantastic. Major downside IMO is the lack of a USB passthrough, since the cheaper offerings sometimes offer it. No lateral key wobble that I've experienced on the SparkBurntMyBacon - Friday, October 7, 2016 - link
Here I thought I got mine for a pretty decent price. Nice catch for $60.garrek99 - Friday, October 7, 2016 - link
Could someone shed light on whether this keyboard's keys are as tightly packed as the G710 models?One of the biggest issues I have with the G710+ is that the keys are too densely fitted.
I just measured the distance between the left and right Shift keys and it is 11 and 1/16 inches long. Would really appreciate a measurement. Thanks.
erple2 - Saturday, October 8, 2016 - link
Any chance you could get one of the original model M keyboards in for review? U icomp still makes them. I'd be interested in how it stacks up with modern mechanical keyboards.erple2 - Saturday, October 8, 2016 - link
Unicomp. Available at www.pckeyboard.com or www dot pckeyboard dot comZim - Sunday, October 9, 2016 - link
Is it just me or is this site going to the dogs? This is the second uninteresting keyboard review I've read here in recent weeks. I guess this is a gamer's review site now, huh? I'll pass.Silma - Monday, October 10, 2016 - link
180 $ is way too expensive for a plastic non-cherry mx keyboard.Regarding macro buttons, I know of no gamers using them, and I'm really wondering if I simply do not know enough gamers, or if it's the ultimate non used feature.
In many games, it is forbidden to use macros keys, and in even more games on professional encounters.
SeanJ76 - Monday, October 10, 2016 - link
I won't switch from rubber dome to mechanical for just too many reasons, my G15 is still lovely and will try to keep it alive as long as I can.NotLupus - Tuesday, October 25, 2016 - link
Great review. I would buy this keyboard if I didn't already have a several years-old mechanical keyboard that works fine. Super review!Wwhat - Sunday, October 30, 2016 - link
Has separate special function keys instead of using the normal function keys double: Huge plusHas a scroll lock key: good job Logitech.
Has a non-removable hand-rest: Oh dear. But they make dremels so that's solvable I suppose.
Another negative is that design on the WASD keys, it's not pretty.
So I'm pretty positive, and as for that double key, it normally registers under a different keycode so you can reprogram it I expect.
I also like that the extra keys are on the side, I think Apple should have done that with their touch bar, since Apple putting it right under the screen on a laptop seems less than ideal to me.
But in the end I will not pay 180 bucks for a keyboard, so I'm out.