A launch delay should surprise no one given the nature of the screen Samsung is attempting to mass produce. Best guess is that the folding phone is either not released this year or is released and becomes the first and last of Samsung's folding handsets for the next five plus years do to very high rates of screen failure. I know the company made a claim that the devices were tested for durability, but it should be clear from the high failure rate of the small number of units sent out for review that real world scenarios were never tested or even considered.
Agreed that it was the right decision - they are definitely avoiding a major headache. However, it's curious they didn't run into these use cases in pre-internal or external testing.
They were likely trying to beat their competitors by being the first to market, but didn't test it thoroughly enough in real world scenarios (since 1000 real folds from a paid human employee takes longer than simulating 1000 folds from a machine that's working 24/7). They got early impressions the longevity wasn't there with initial sampling, and did the mature thing and just delayed the launch to try to work out those problems. It's clear that being the first to market wouldn't be worth permanently soiling the reputation of their brand, of that specific device, or of folding screens in future products.
They were also probably not very keen for it to be out in the open. Some of the technology has already been nicked, and for sure there is demand for more of it.
They prob just tested internally and not real world things. A guy that sits at desk all day in Samsung testing device or engineer is not going to get results vs a guy who works at walmart or construction.
Hate to point it out, but neither a Walmart employee, nor a construction worker are within a few standard deviations of the salary distribution from the target audience of this model. I agree this was likely a failure in testing methodology, since the reports seem tied to 1) Dumb reviewers peeling the protective layer off (the failure is from how much force was needed to do this, ending in broken OLED panels 2) Little to no testing of particle ingress around the hinge assembly and behind the OLED panel
While a delay does prevent problems from landing in the lap of consumers, I think the "crones" you're talking would generally agree that even going to the press with the Fold in its current state was an unwise move. Bragging up the testing methods and talking about durability to said press was a self-inflicted wound as it is clear that testing did not identify obvious shortcomings.
That whole screen-protector thing is crazy. I'll bet after a year it would have all sorts of grit and lint slowly peeling up the edges, even if you tried to keep it neat.
boggles my mind that they thought it would be ok like that. So it looks like it's removable, it *is* in fact removable- and (this is critical) it is *easily removable*- and the device breaks if you remove it.
And as you said, if it can be trivially peeled off by users, it's definitely going to start to come up on it's own eventually
Pre-installed screen protecting films aren't that rare actually. And the deep dives where groups attempted to break the phones all said the film was NOT easily removable, it was quite firmly attached. The breakage was due to the force needed to pull the film off, with uneven distribution of pressure, the screens were breaking before the film was even fully removed.
I wouldn't say it's easily removable. All the photos by people who have removed it seem to show the protector very mangled. They must have applied obviously excessive force.
Not that it's a good design in the first place, but some tech reviewers are rather dim.
Seeing how fragile normal smartphone screens are, any tool could tell this would end in fail.
Sure its a different 'tech' but really? Give it another two years of development and then try 200 prototypes with staff for 6 months and see how many are still going after that.
I'm reasonably certain they took whatever prototype phase they were at and declared it to be a shippable product because they got wind that Huawei was about to announce a foldable pocket computer. All so they could claim they were first. It worked well initially, with the press gushing over Samsung's "world-first" announcement(beating Huawei by a couple of hours). But now it has blown up in their faces, because it is a product that clearly WASN'T ready to ship.
I'll repeat: go look up foldable screen patents as I did years ago. You'll find at least one, I've long forgotten whose, that included a diagram of a clamshell/flip-phone. In particular, the 'screen' doesn't fold on a crease, a la a newspaper, but rather with a distinct radius. Why anyone would be stupid enough to do what Samsung did...?
As the old Country song goes "You have to know when to hold'em, know when to fold'em..". Samsung rushed this out the door to beat Huawei to the punch, but the bleeding edge is called that for a reason. Why they would ship them without at least a few weeks of real-life testing is beyond me. I also wonder if making a thicker device (just a few mm) would alleviate the enormous mechanical stress in the hinge region enough to avoid the material fatigue these units developed.
Ever wonder why we don't still have those squishy plastic topped touchscreens from the bygone palm-pilot and winmo days? Ever wonder if Ford is going to offer plastic windows on their SUV's?
That's the trade off. Market forces clearly changed us from plastic topped screens to glass in 99.9% of devices that face a harsh on the person duty cycle. A folding phone is a solution out in search of a problem.
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PeachNCream - Tuesday, April 23, 2019 - link
A launch delay should surprise no one given the nature of the screen Samsung is attempting to mass produce. Best guess is that the folding phone is either not released this year or is released and becomes the first and last of Samsung's folding handsets for the next five plus years do to very high rates of screen failure. I know the company made a claim that the devices were tested for durability, but it should be clear from the high failure rate of the small number of units sent out for review that real world scenarios were never tested or even considered.shabby - Tuesday, April 23, 2019 - link
Did they not test this in the real world? Did they really think those robots perfectly folding it was enough?stanleyipkiss - Tuesday, April 23, 2019 - link
Stop being crones.Samsung made the best and most mature decision available to them. A recall and delay prevents stuff like the Note 7 fiasco.
vortmax2 - Tuesday, April 23, 2019 - link
Agreed that it was the right decision - they are definitely avoiding a major headache. However, it's curious they didn't run into these use cases in pre-internal or external testing.JoeyJoJo123 - Tuesday, April 23, 2019 - link
They were likely trying to beat their competitors by being the first to market, but didn't test it thoroughly enough in real world scenarios (since 1000 real folds from a paid human employee takes longer than simulating 1000 folds from a machine that's working 24/7). They got early impressions the longevity wasn't there with initial sampling, and did the mature thing and just delayed the launch to try to work out those problems. It's clear that being the first to market wouldn't be worth permanently soiling the reputation of their brand, of that specific device, or of folding screens in future products.Tams80 - Thursday, April 25, 2019 - link
They were also probably not very keen for it to be out in the open. Some of the technology has already been nicked, and for sure there is demand for more of it.imaheadcase - Tuesday, April 23, 2019 - link
They prob just tested internally and not real world things. A guy that sits at desk all day in Samsung testing device or engineer is not going to get results vs a guy who works at walmart or construction.FullmetalTitan - Wednesday, April 24, 2019 - link
Hate to point it out, but neither a Walmart employee, nor a construction worker are within a few standard deviations of the salary distribution from the target audience of this model.I agree this was likely a failure in testing methodology, since the reports seem tied to
1) Dumb reviewers peeling the protective layer off (the failure is from how much force was needed to do this, ending in broken OLED panels
2) Little to no testing of particle ingress around the hinge assembly and behind the OLED panel
PeachNCream - Wednesday, April 24, 2019 - link
While a delay does prevent problems from landing in the lap of consumers, I think the "crones" you're talking would generally agree that even going to the press with the Fold in its current state was an unwise move. Bragging up the testing methods and talking about durability to said press was a self-inflicted wound as it is clear that testing did not identify obvious shortcomings.mkozakewich - Tuesday, April 23, 2019 - link
That whole screen-protector thing is crazy. I'll bet after a year it would have all sorts of grit and lint slowly peeling up the edges, even if you tried to keep it neat.KateH - Wednesday, April 24, 2019 - link
boggles my mind that they thought it would be ok like that. So it looks like it's removable, it *is* in fact removable- and (this is critical) it is *easily removable*- and the device breaks if you remove it.And as you said, if it can be trivially peeled off by users, it's definitely going to start to come up on it's own eventually
FullmetalTitan - Wednesday, April 24, 2019 - link
Pre-installed screen protecting films aren't that rare actually. And the deep dives where groups attempted to break the phones all said the film was NOT easily removable, it was quite firmly attached. The breakage was due to the force needed to pull the film off, with uneven distribution of pressure, the screens were breaking before the film was even fully removed.Tams80 - Thursday, April 25, 2019 - link
I wouldn't say it's easily removable. All the photos by people who have removed it seem to show the protector very mangled. They must have applied obviously excessive force.Not that it's a good design in the first place, but some tech reviewers are rather dim.
jabber - Tuesday, April 23, 2019 - link
Seeing how fragile normal smartphone screens are, any tool could tell this would end in fail.Sure its a different 'tech' but really? Give it another two years of development and then try 200 prototypes with staff for 6 months and see how many are still going after that.
Lord of the Bored - Wednesday, April 24, 2019 - link
I'm reasonably certain they took whatever prototype phase they were at and declared it to be a shippable product because they got wind that Huawei was about to announce a foldable pocket computer. All so they could claim they were first.It worked well initially, with the press gushing over Samsung's "world-first" announcement(beating Huawei by a couple of hours). But now it has blown up in their faces, because it is a product that clearly WASN'T ready to ship.
FunBunny2 - Tuesday, April 23, 2019 - link
I'll repeat: go look up foldable screen patents as I did years ago. You'll find at least one, I've long forgotten whose, that included a diagram of a clamshell/flip-phone. In particular, the 'screen' doesn't fold on a crease, a la a newspaper, but rather with a distinct radius. Why anyone would be stupid enough to do what Samsung did...?Old_Fogie_Late_Bloomer - Tuesday, April 23, 2019 - link
As far as I've heard, the Samsung fold display does, in fact, fold to a radius, albeit not a large one.nevcairiel - Wednesday, April 24, 2019 - link
Everything folds to a radius, something like a thin newspaper just folds to an extremely narrow radius.nevcairiel - Wednesday, April 24, 2019 - link
The reason this isn't the prefered option is of course that it makes the devices extremely bulky when folded.flyingpants265 - Wednesday, April 24, 2019 - link
Seems obvious there should be some slack left in the screen to avoid a crease..eastcoast_pete - Wednesday, April 24, 2019 - link
Could you post the link to the patent or the patents you're referring to? Thanks!FunBunny2 - Thursday, April 25, 2019 - link
I can't find the diagram I recall, but this is close, 2013: https://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/2013/...eastcoast_pete - Wednesday, April 24, 2019 - link
As the old Country song goes "You have to know when to hold'em, know when to fold'em..". Samsung rushed this out the door to beat Huawei to the punch, but the bleeding edge is called that for a reason. Why they would ship them without at least a few weeks of real-life testing is beyond me. I also wonder if making a thicker device (just a few mm) would alleviate the enormous mechanical stress in the hinge region enough to avoid the material fatigue these units developed.Gunbuster - Wednesday, April 24, 2019 - link
Ever wonder why we don't still have those squishy plastic topped touchscreens from the bygone palm-pilot and winmo days? Ever wonder if Ford is going to offer plastic windows on their SUV's?No, because the better material for it is GLASS.
Tams80 - Thursday, April 25, 2019 - link
Glass at the moment isn't very flexible though. It's also, no matter the recipe, rather shatter prone.Gunbuster - Thursday, April 25, 2019 - link
That's the trade off. Market forces clearly changed us from plastic topped screens to glass in 99.9% of devices that face a harsh on the person duty cycle. A folding phone is a solution out in search of a problem.FunBunny2 - Thursday, April 25, 2019 - link
"A folding phone is a solution out in search of a problem."au contraire. a sturdy clamshell protects the screen better than some clear plastic sheet.